Over Thinking?

[T Dog]

OK Ok Ok
So my online play can improve by playin MORE tables at once where I end up with MORE decisions to make MORE often!
As I have little or no visual clues on any player because we are online and almost completely anonymous, the decisions I make have to be 99% based upon player history (almost nil because fairly new to online) and MATHS!
Pre Flop I can do!
After the Flop, I am faced with even more unanswered questions! Mostly based on Maths and the odds I am getting from calling or betting.

Due to a few years of mostly live play, I am obviously able to quickly work out most PRE FLOP answers, its the answers after I've been called and the flop hits the felt that I struggle to find quickly and believe I am giving away hands that I should be playing due to this. Some are completely obv, like i have mid pockets and board is all pictures! And then the other way where you flop the monster or even nuts, however these times are in the minority and unless I can work out the odds for the rest, I fold the hand. I'm not saying I can't calculate the odds, just I'm not yet quick enough.

So my question is this:
What (if anything) can I do to "simplify" the maths so the answers to these questions come quickly and easily?

[hip]

Pot odds...in a nutshell (not spot on but close)

1) Calculate no. of outs.
For example, if you have an open ender straight draw you will have 8 outs.
- Hero: J,10
- Board: KQ3
- Outs: A or 9 (total of 8 outs)

2) x2 (always x2)
- 8 outs x 2=16

3) x no. of cards to come.
-On the flop (with an open-ender straight draw) you have 2 cards to come (turn+river), therfore=x2. 16x2=32%

-On the turn you have 1 card to come (river), therefore=x1. 16x1=16%

[whitey9999]

Well theres always the rule of 4 and 2 -
Quite simply multiply your outs by 4 after flop or 2 after turn to get ur percentage of improving your hand

[hip]

Ok, so here's a test for you op.

in a limped pot (seems like everyone is holding junk), the board comes out:



You are holding:

what would you say your odds of winning are heads up against a villan in the blind who just bet out.

[Tony]

I would win no questions asked!

[ship2me]

meh
You're a 60% fav , I'd say at a qik calc.

Irrespective of other holdings

Ok, so here's a test for you op.

in a limped pot (seems like everyone is holding junk), the board comes out:



You are holding:

what would you say your odds of winning are heads up against a villan in the blind who just bet out.

[whitey9999]

After ppl have had a crack can you explain it, Coz I got 84% doing it your way and the app on my iphone says its 66% if villain hit and 80% if they didnt

3 J + 3 10 + 9 h + 3 Q + 3 7 = 21 outs

21*2*2= 84%

Seems a little high

[Zutroy]

80% is just ridiculous, you can’t just assume that they’re all outs, as the following holdings in your opponent’s hand, mean you lose the accompanying outs.

89 – a single J or T are now no good.
T7 – J now makes a straight
67 – T now makes a straight
Ahxh, Khxh or Qhxh – hearts are now no good.

Obv all of these aren’t going to happen at the same time, but in a limped pot, many are possible.

I don’t know what the number should be, but this definitely needs to be taken into account.

[hip]

[ ]good example used.

the example i used wasn't a good one. there are to many outs which blows out margin of error.

But in this example, if we take the villan and assume he has a 9 with no overcards or draws then:

Jh Th 682 68.89 308 31.11 0 0.00 0.689
9s 4s 308 31.11 682 68.89 0 0.00 0.311

New example:

ah kh

on a board of:

6h,4h,10c

assuming he has a pair, what is your odds?

[whitey9999]

3 A + 3 K + 9 hearts = 15 outs

60%

Sounds a bit more realistic then the last one

I was told you cant take into account the other person's hand when calculating outs, so its basically a calculation on improving your hand ?