Value Bet River?

[thkcduckworth]

I think my check on the turn is fine because I don't want to be check-raised out of the pot with my full house and flush re-draw.

However I think I should have value bet the river for like half-pot when he checks to me. I don't think he has Aces or Kings in his range because he most likely would have 3bet me on the flop to push out a straight or flush draw.

He never has a flush when he checks the river after I've checked the turn behind him, but could show up with QJ or J10 on occasions.

What do you guys think, is there an argument to a bet-fold value bet on the river, or better to see a showdown?

Table #25990143 - Sunnyside
Starting Hand #1231427313
Start time of hand: 17 Mar 2010 01:51:54
Last Hand #1231426710
Game Type: HOLD'EM
Limit Type: NO LIMIT
Table Type: RING
Money Type: REAL MONEY
Blinds are now $0.25/$0.50
Button is at seat 8
Seat 1: Davidrico1 - $19.73
Seat 2: tatramocny - $27.28
Seat 3: NothingZ - $49.94
Seat 4: XXXavier - $49.50
Seat 5: D0nkeyB0y - $50
Seat 6: hutsuhai - $81.48
Seat 8: tRaMSt0p - $124.68
Seat 9: KingSpear - $64.57
Seat 10: allangomez - $45.39
Moving Button to seat 9
allangomez posts small blind ($0.25)
Davidrico1 posts big blind ($0.50)
Shuffling Deck
Dealing Cards
Dealing to tRaMSt0p
tatramocny folds
NothingZ folds
XXXavier folds
hutsuhai raises to $1.75
tRaMSt0p calls $1.75
KingSpear folds
allangomez folds
Davidrico1 folds
Dealing Flop
hutsuhai bets $3
tRaMSt0p raises to $11
hutsuhai calls $11
Dealing Turn
hutsuhai checks
tRaMSt0p checks
Dealing River
hutsuhai checks
tRaMSt0p checks
Taking Rake of $1.31 from pot 1
tRaMSt0p shows
tRaMSt0p has Two Pairs: Queens, 10s
hutsuhai mucks
tRaMSt0p wins $24.94 with: Two Pairs: Queens, 10s
Seat 1: Davidrico1 - $19.23
Seat 2: tatramocny - $27.28
Seat 3: NothingZ - $49.94
Seat 4: XXXavier - $49.50
Seat 5: D0nkeyB0y - $50
Seat 6: hutsuhai - $68.73
Seat 8: tRaMSt0p - $136.87
Seat 9: KingSpear - $64.57
Seat 10: allangomez - $45.14
End Of Hand #1231427313

[HelloJohnny]

Despite the wet wet board, once it goes check/check on the turn and he checks the river, you are probably in front on the river, but it's tough to justify a value bet as AQ is probably the only worse hand that *might* think about paying you off. Check is fine IMO.

[Johnny_OMG]

YES YES YES
Being in position with the line played im betting the river there.

Situation reasoning:

By betting 2/3 pot or more on wet boards in position often opens up the opponents perception of you bluffing and calling you down with Tx and Qx hands rather than taking the check raise line (as they have showdown value)

Nearly all other 2pair combos check call you after checking the river including I think most of the time straights are betting the river as they are losing a lot of value given the turn action.

Im betting $17-$18 on that river. If u experience resistance via a check raise reassess but all things considered u r getting check raised by the absolute top of their range or a stone cold bluff.

Hand history & table image reasoning:

Assuming u get called by 2pair or lighter - Opponents will probably adjust so id make notes that i value towned or over bet a wet board with top 2 etc and got paid off.
Assuming they fold - 1 less hand opponents have information about you.
Line you played - Opponents see you are too tight to value bet top 2 on scary boards and may bust future bluffs rather than thinking twice before going into check call mode when faced with tough decisions OOP

[CNT_CRUSHER]

lol value betting the river is not that far off the equivalent of turning your hand into a bluff.

[TurnRiva]

Originally Posted by CNT_CRUSHER

lol value betting the river is not that far off the equivalent of turning your hand into a bluff.

This

[hip]

horrible turn and river cards...i like checking

[SwoopAE]

Although a vbet is ok in some situations I prefer checking back in a vacuum

[Johnny_OMG]

Originally Posted by CNT_CRUSHER

lol value betting the river is not that far off the equivalent of turning your hand into a bluff.

true i just reckon its sexy betting the river in occasional spots like this example. bluffing perhaps but with the best hand

I think in cash games im always critical of myself for missing a street of value whereas id probably err on the side of caution in tournaments and check. Any thoughts on whether you agree or not would be taken on board.

btw It tilts people when they snap call with the losing hand. i love getting under players skin and i know when i check call someone in that spot im like 'fuckin smart ass value towning on that board' wp wp ....C#NT' lol

[twostate]

Originally Posted by Johnny_OMG

true i just reckon its sexy betting the river in occasional spots like this example. bluffing perhaps but with the best hand

I think in cash games im always critical of myself for missing a street of value whereas id probably err on the side of caution in tournaments and check. Any thoughts on whether you agree or not would be taken on board.

btw It tilts people when they snap call with the losing hand. i love getting under players skin and i know when i check call someone in that spot im like 'fuckin smart ass value towning on that board' wp wp ....C#NT' lol

Are they ever calling with worse?

[Al]

I dont mind betting the turn with stack sizes like that. Getting raised isnt a complete disaster.

The way the hand went I think a river bet is still for value. Bet an amount KQ could call.