Can Phill Hellmuth really play?

[JK.]

Hellmuth just won the WPT event in Cannes.An impressive tournament and well presented on TV.
I watched it in my lounge in Moscow.
OK he won but there were many glaring errors in his play.
In one hand he was holding 9-4.The board wes 6-J-J-6-4.The other guy bet several hundred thousand and Phill called and announced two pairs.
Does he really know the game or is he bluffing us?
He just had a nine high and thought he won.
If a guy like this wins tournaments,just how much skill is in tournament play?

[optimaline]

Hi JK

The old tourney skill debate ey. Not going to bite but just wanted to mention that I'm sure PH knew his 4 was counterfeited and thus was declaring his two pair to read J's and 6's with 9 kicker. You honestly don't think he would of thought otherwise after playing NLHE for most of his life? Discounting the very small off-chance that he miss-read the board to think his 4's were in play.
Also, just to nit-pick John, this was a WSOP-E main event not WPT, giving him his 13th bracelet.

[HeeHaw]

13 bracelets sort of says he can play. IMO he can arguably lay claim to being the best NLHE live tournament player in history. Lets not forget he has won over $4m in WSOP events in the past 2 years. If he can't play then I wish I could play as poorly as PH allegedly does.

[JK.]

Not more of these comercial WSOP events.I remember when there were only two or three events a year and you
knew who were the best players at the time.
Now with American tournaments and European tournaments you can have 50 "Worlds' Best Plyers "in one year.

Thirteen bracelets in "THIRTY" years.You call that good.
Someone must win more bracelets than othe people,especially if they have played in every WSOP tournament for 30 years.
What a sad life.
I played against Phill 20 odd years ago at the Golden Nuggett.When he walked in people on my table all said,here comes that idiot again.
He lasted about 30 minutes,blasted the player who beat him and threw the cards in the dealers' face.
He then rushed to another casino for another tournament.
I have not liked him from that moment.When the cards hit the dealers' face I almost got up to smash this idiot but the security got in first.I did say some nicely chosen Aussie words to bid him farewell.

I would love to know how much he has spent on entry fees over the last 30 years.

[Linda B]

Hi JK

You exagerate as usual, Phil Helmuth was too young to enter US Casinos 30 years ago. Let's say 25 or 26 years. 1 bracelet every 2 years.

Apparently it cost $238,500 to enter every US WSOP event this year (excluding One Drop) and Helmuth does not play them all. So over 4 years he has paid far less than he has won at the WSOP.

It seems that confidence/ego is an important factor in Poker success (as in most other competitivie endeavours). Not that I condone his behaviour. He has in the past sought help for his outbursts, but probably finds them profitable from a marketing point of view, I'm afraid.

[HeeHaw]

Hi JK,

Once again you have asked the forum a question you already have answered for yourself. I know of a lot of very good players who are complete assholes. PH is one of them (an asshole). That, however, has nothing to do with your original question.

I'm glad you gave him a few choice words because it sounds like he deserved them. PH polarises people like few other poker players do.

2 or 3 events a year eh. Pretty small sample size to judge the best players. And besides, don't you keep saying tournament poker is all about luck not skill? So the winners of those 2 or 3 events would be the luckiest not the best.

And, yes, I think 13 bracelets in 30 years is good. Name one other player to do it. There are none.

JK, where is it claimed that the winner of a WSOP bracelet is the "Worlds' Best Plyers" (sic)? I only stated that due to PH winning 13 bracelets (12 in NLHE) he can stake a claim to being the best NLHE live tournament player. This claim would be completely subjective though. The guy can't play cash for shit but he certainly knows how to navigate his way through a live MTT. He sure does need to work on his demeanour and table etiquette though. Hope he doesn't because he is so damn entertaining. I love to hate him.

Anyway, haters are always going to hate.

[HeeHaw]

BTW JK,

I appreciate you starting these threads and trying to keep Pokernetwork alive and kicking. Hopefully these forums return to their former glory.

[JK.]

Thankyou HeeHaw.You have good insight.You will become a good poker player.

[JK.]

Back to the subject.

Do you remember ,I don't remember his name,Joe Hachems' brother.
He won some series which crowned him Australian Champion or something like that.
Tournaments were held in all australian states and the points leader was crowned the champion.
I don't know if he won any of the tournaments but he managed to play in all of them and somehow stumbled over the line first.
He was sponsored and could affort to travel interstate to all he events.
If I am not mistaken he was one of very few who played in all the events.
Is he a worthy champion just because he played in all the events?
It is my belief that he can't play for nuts and got sponsored because he was someones brother.

Same goes for the other clown,Phill.
He has probably played in more WSOP tournaments than any other player alive.It must add up to hundreds and hundreds.
Of course he is favoured to win more than any other player as he has played in many more than any other player.
Besides,if you have 1000 players playing many tournaments,someone has to win more tournaments thanothers.
This is probability but how can you call someone the Worlds' best when he has only won 13out of hundreds of tournaments and he can't play cash ?
Linda I am sorry if my 30 years was only 28/29.Mind you he was very young when he started and he never grew up.
Poor guy.
I hope it was not, playing so much poker,that stunted his personal development.

[HeeHaw]

Thankyou HeeHaw.You have good insight.You will become a good poker player.

lol at me becoming a good poker player. I only make money from live cash cos there are so many gamblefish in Australian casinos. Blackjack was my game when I frequented casinos regularly. Living on an island in the north of Queensland now restricts me but we do have quite a few fishy home games going on here.