Poker Players,Money,Lending and Borrowing.

[liquidradio]

The plan is perfect.He greets you as your "new best friend" each time you arrive at the poker table.He introduces you to all his friends and relatives.He is the first to offer you "a few hundred" the moment your All-In doesn't go to plan.He buys you drinks and dinner, as you do for him.Then it happens.One day, he walks in and lets you in on his little secret. He is broke today, and needs a couple racks of $500 "just to get back in the game.....you understand" ?Of course you do.You gladly do your friend the service of finance.He's your mate, right ?Days become weeks become months become years.Your "Poker Friend" has given you every excuse under the sun...yet $$$ are yet to be seen.Welcome to the world, friends.Its hard to be in any circles, not JUST POKER, and not get stung by people financially.We see it in the Poker World every Tournament.The first few days are fine.Everyone is cashed up and ready to go.Then disaster.Bad beats, excess partying, table games, poker machines, Roulette......the list goes on.Broke."Do you have a spare few hundred....will pay you back" ?There is no easy answer to this.All you can do is have the same policy for all.Its a tough topic - there are no winners in this.Tread carefully.

[Goofy]

I see this at Crown everyday. People borrowing money from friends inevitably leads to broken relationships. There are quite a few winning poker players out there. Unfortunately for them, bankroll management and gambling on other activities are their vices. That is the real source of the problem.

[josh37]

we are missing the underlying reason here - people dont think about their bankrolls enough to ensure that they dont go broke. they dont understand how much they should have to play at certain limits, and are playing waay above their heads. there was an extremely good book - "professional Poker - the Essential guide to playing for a living" by Mark Blade - that covers bankroll issues more indepth than any other poker book i have read (about 20 or so). although most of the advice is common sense, it is good for the aspiring pro (well one day hopefully) to start practicing these "tough love" rules from the beginning of their career and never have to explain why their stance on a matter changed. why are we so dumb to allow ourselves to be convinced by someone that cannot deal with money properly (as they have none left and dont understand the essential concepts of a bankroll) to lend them some? is it the rhetoric of "i am good for it - i will pay you back at XYZ place" that makes us feel a little better? as poker players and as some of us will be poker superstars one day, we really need to start seeing these people as what they are:- stupid, and bad with money, especially poker money. maybe another good rule of thumb is that if you must lend money, you should never lend money to someone that has less liquid assets than you do. it is always hard to ask for money when you have more than them and dont really need it - however if they have more, there really shouldnt be a problem asking. anyway i know my bankroll is goign to be safe forever and hopefully i will always have that first $10 that i have turned into a four grand. JoshP.S. this post is not to insult anyone that has previously borrowed money. it was meant as an insight into my thoughts on people that need to borrow money to play poker. on this forum we have a higher percentage of winners at poker than the public at large, so we are goign to be approached for a loan more often than anyone else on average. what should be important is that every time someone goes broke and ask us for money - we ask them why they need it, and in what circumstances it was lost. then think about how good these guys are at managing a bankroll - and put your bankroll where it belongs - back in your pocket.

[liquidradio]

Sports Betting and Racing have accounted for many a Poker Dollar in the past.Its the gamble that lures us ?

[Bugsy]

Well someone in another thread quoted Harry s truman , so i think it is only fair that I quote Winston churchill.Shortly after the battle of britain he made a speech about some of the good borrowers in the poker world when he said " Never before has so much been owed to so many by so few "

[yoyo]

Josh, you denigrate yourself too much for someone that has turned $10 into $4000 in poker. I know that is only the beginning for you, but its a marvellous success story. Very, very few people in poker would have stories like that. Too many get a tiny taste of success and blow their bankroll on a level too high for them, even if that level is 1/2. Hurry up, read your books and learn fast, my man. If by mid-way through next year, you aren't advising me on hands, I shall be very disappointed.yoyo

[Don Dingo U R STINKY]

Now this is an interesting thread. My couple of points are:I have gambled for more than 20 years now. In all of that time I have only met 1 person (ONE - and its not me) that has been a winner over time. If you gamble you will loose - period.Im no $5 roulette player either - people that know me, know that I can punt.In NSW alone they estimate there are 200,000 problem gamblers. One of the reasons I stopped going to casino's (any why when I do I only play big limits away from the general public) was having people ask to lend money from me, having women offer to fuck / blow me for cab fare home as they have lost the family mortgage payments etc etc etc.However - The main reason I stopped going to casinos is the type of people you interact (punters and staff at times) with and the environment your in (a money orientated superfical / false world).Gamblers are like people who take drugs - you cant believe a word they say. Im always amazed how people become wankers over a little money they have won or lost. Its basicaly because they have no life. Play for fun, enjoy your poker, gamble (like drinking) never alone and always with your friends and keep it to what it should be - an enjoyable past time.

[knightfan]

"I have gambled for more than 20 years now. In all of that time I have only met 1 person (ONE - and its not me) that has been a winner over time. If you gamble you will loose - period." i have to disagree here for the simpl fact i personally know 4 "pro" punters all of which have been for around 10 years1 owns 3 houses all of which are worth more that a million each ( 1 unit on sydney harbour)they own boats, cars you name it they got the BEST of it... so sure if you GAMBLE sure you would probably lose in the long run but if you do your homework and study hard you can win quite often...kinda like the stock market..invest in the right horse or dog or whatever at the right time and you got a winner

[yoyo]

Good post Dom Dingo - gambling is a BIG problem in Australia (and around the world).I have to disagree with you on the drinking though - I never drink - unless I'm alone..or with somebody.yoyo

[MakybeDiva]

Depends exactly what you mean by 'gamble' Rob.Fact of the matter is, poker is different from all other forms of gambling in that there is no 'edge' to the house, and if you have studied the theoritical aspects of the game, over time you will win.This holds true with horse racing as well, although it is extremely more difficult to be a winner at as compared to poker. More than likely you need inside information in order to make a profit (by inside information I mean something such as going to an early morning track session and watching horses train rather than listen to what the trainer says, not something like a trainer telling you "don't back my horse today, I told the jockey to get it boxed in").Apart from that, most other forms of gambling ultimately make you a loser.