Thought you might!

All good points, especially 1 and 2. 3 I think can always be a danger of any democratic process, in fact does not seem any different to many of the "democracies" we have created in African/Middle Eastern States over the years.

But I just cannot shift the idea in my head that being forced to vote is no different from not being allowed to vote, in that it removes a freedom from you. But more importantly it makes sure that a good 30%+ of the votes are made by people who appear to have no interest or no knowledge in what they are voting for. This in my book can never be good.

Just a strange thing to me when i have spent my whole life in countries where voting is a choice, No doubt had I lived somewhere like Australia and was used to this idea I may well feel differently.

Lol, you may have a point!

Come on, it was not an absolute statement at all, "almost" and "not many" left the door open here, although I will agree that maybe I could of left it open a little wider.

Yes of course the democrats win in the U.S., and far more relevant Labour win elections in the UK but they often do win elections with more conservative policies and agenda's than you would expect and thus capture much of the middle ground who are desperate for a change of leadership after a conservative Government has built a strong economy. They do this one would think primarily because they know full well that they would never win an election with left wing policies due to the fact that the majority of people who want to vote are far more likely to be better educated and employed. The Democrats are certainly a party who are slightly left of center, rather than very left of center as labor/labour.

And it is a fact, backed up by leaked party documents, that Labour had a policy of letting in far too many immigrants from Eastern Europe in order to increase the numbers of Labour voters. It sounds like right wing paranoia I know, but it is actually true. They obviously share the same feelings themselves!

So while a Labor Government would still be electable under a system like the UK or US, I would think it would be a lot harder and it certainly would be a different Labor than the current Government and with more conservative policies - Tony Blair 1997 / even KRudd 07.

I don't think i know it all, at all. Just an opinion, but I think it has some merit!

I am a foreign C*nt.

But I know that in Australia it is in fact spelled L-a-b-o-r and not Labour.

Apart from that you have a point, I think mandatory voting makes Australia one of the most undemocratic countries in the Western world. It should be everyones democratic right not to vote if they so wish, either as a protest or as an admission they do not know anything about current affairs and therefore are too stupid to make a decision that will have a serious impact on our economy and way of life.

It is almost impossible to argue with the fact that without mandatory voting labor would not win many elections at all.

Seems easy to pop on here and make a throwaway statement like that without explaining why some people are wrong. It would mean much more if you demonstrate how everyone is wrong and you are right. Or would that be too difficult.

Are you planning to pop back and expand on this post?

Interesting times.

What is going on down in Melbourne? Do these people hate money so much?

Excellent job by Tony Abbot whatever happens from here, Labor may stay in power but they will not have any mandate to push through much of their policy that would be harmful to our economy.

I think however that the Independents really have no option but to add their seats to the LNP and Tony Abbot will be PM this week.

Yep, obviously I am no guru but I would be worried about checking this flop and risking him getting a free turn card that could be hitting him in so many ways. I think I bet out here and try and keep control of the pot, being out of position does not help at all, hence why I would be 4betting this pre.

I think you are giving him a little too much credit with his range, with no reads I would have to include a few suited connectors, 77+ maybe, AJ+. I have seen 3bets from late positions with these kind of hands plenty enough to never rule them out. There are too many hands he could have that connect with this flop and I would have to bet at it to get him out.

Interesting hand to post, I am looking forward to some of the replies.

This is likely my last post in this thread, hahaha, a huge sigh of relief from poker players everywhere. But just wanted to point out that today is a new day, and what a difference a day makes in an election campaign.

The Liberals could still yet win this thing, most of the Newspapers in Australia have surprisingly come out in favour of the opposition and are asking readers to dump Labor. The polls are still showing a lot of undecided and this factor will swing some votes back towards the Liberals. It really is 50/50 now and anything could happen.

Last word goes to today's Courier Mail...

This should worry everyone, I don't care who you are voting for or what you think about the NBN. If this does not worry you even slightly then there is no helping you.

Remember, this is about a project that Labor have already decided to spend $43 billion of our money on.

An interview with Stephen Conroy...


$43b of public funds to be spent on a risky, high tech start-up company and not only is there no business case in place but the minister in charge believes that a business case would be a

"Waste of time, waste of effort, waste of money."


Hold on to your hats folks, the next three years is gonna be a rough old ride.

Yes, Labor will win, I will be watching and packing!

Okay, maybe not packing just yet, but am not expecting many great things to happen. There is talk tonight that Labor is going to introduce a carbon tax as soon as they have won and there is even more talk about a raise in income tax levels - of course this being a Labor Government can only mean that a raise in income tax levels will only apply to the dirty, greedy, selfish rich people who have the nerve to get good jobs and work hard.

Maybe they will surprise me and do a good job, probably not though.

Difficult to compare bars in the U.S. to bars over here, everything is much cheaper in the U.S. Bars over there will cost a fraction of what is costs to run a bar here, wages are much lower, real estate is massively cheaper so rents are low, utilities are cheaper and this is a total guess but I have to imagine that taxes, rates and Gov charges are much lower too.

A better comparison is the U.K., a similar culture of going out to get drunk as here in Australia (not really big a part of U.S. culture anyway) and no pokies in the pubs - In fact it is against the law to take horse racing bets in U.K. pubs too. - okay, while I say no pokies that is a slight lie, you are allowed a very small number of machines in a pub, but it is highly regulated and the majority pubs will only have one machine and all of these are 25p a play games with a 15 quid jackpot - nobody goes to a pub to just gamble. But similar to Australia they have higher wages and costs than the U.S. and of course just as much red tape.

Anyway, the point is that British pubs did okay without the gambling profits our pubs here make so to be fair you do have a point. But the pubs were always more expensive than many of the RSL's and hotels with lots of pokies here. But anyway, the British pub industry is in a severe decline now and pubs are closing all over. It does seem this is all down the the anti-smoking laws that only came into force three years ago, in a cold, rainy country nobody wants to go outside for a fag so many are staying at home.

Last year QLD Gov made $518m from pokies, which while not be a massive sum in the grand scheme of things, it is still $250 per person a year and will need to replaced from somewhere. We would end up paying for a pokie ban, yes, most likely more expensive drinks, but also in higher taxes.

Hahaha, not sure what to say to that!

Joey beat me too it but was gonna suggest you vote for me sometime in the future, I am half serious too, how scary does that sound? Lol. I have always had the thought it my head that one day I might give it a go.

Anyway, I have ranted a bit on here, often after a few glasses of wine so I hope I have not offended anyone. It all seems good natured enough.

Only two days to go (thank God) Gogogogogo Tony!!!!

Lol, I actually thought it was a serious name, in an ironic way.

Oh well, enjoy your break. It is nice to get away from poker for a while anyway, tends to take over your life too much if you let it.

Drink on the other hand? No way, don't know how you can do it.

Jesus Christ. I have been worrying all week about my grey roots showing and now I have to got to start worrying about red roots??

Good post, but I have to respond, sorry, and now I have had a drink and all I will try not to ramble on incoherently, but doubt I will succeed.

I don't know what to say about your first point, If I had the answers then I would have a Nobel prize and be nobbing a movie star. Yes, not everyone has the same opportunities in life, yes it would be nice to do something to help them. But really that has nothing to do with the issue being discussed here, which was about banning pokies, or the wider argument of living in a dictatorship. I think capitalism can provide a safety net and welfare for others quite successfully, but only those who need it and not the rest who abuse it for everyone else. Labor Governments like to turn a blind eye to that little problem and yet the biggest drain of welfare tend to be the ones who really do not need to be on welfare in the first place.

But you miss my point, I despise pokies for many reasons, but all of them are to do with how they piss me off. Whether it is the constant nagging bleep bleep bleep you get in Vegas when trying to play poker or just the low lifes they attract to an otherwise decent pub. Like I said I would not go as far as suggesting they should be banned but I am a selfish cock and would rather they did not exist at all. But the point is that my wishes are just that, my own wishes and only Fascists would dare suggest that their own wishes are enough reason to stop someone else doing what they enjoy.

I am glad we agree on something at least, to anyone with half a brain capitalism of course beats the pants off of socialism/communism for healthy and productive society, only Queen Jooolya and her fabian society mates would disagree with that.

And yes, it is not perfect, by any stretch. The GFC have proven that, there are a lot of greedy bastards who took the piss and screwed things up for many people. But without one you do not get the other and the perhaps the price to pay for a system that rewards and encourages hard work, innovation, sacrifice and knowledge is the fact that some people will get too greedy and take advantage. I would much rather deal with that than live in a country where being talented, bright and entrepreneurial means nothing or means you get taxed far much more than anyone else because your success is deemed to be unfair to the rest.

The simple point is that Labor/Labour are always awful Governments, they really are. I was born under the worst Labour Government the UK has ever seen and they left the whole country a total mess. Unions ran the show, everything was shut, power strikes, teachers strikes, no rubbish collection, 4 day working weeks. It took 16 years of a conservative Government to turn things around and build an economy the world was envious of, It took a month for the new generation (my generation) to vote Labour back in based on nothing more than Tony Blairs lies and spin. 13 years later and the country is right back where is was - a total basket case. All the money gone, a public sector busting at the seams (Labour loves hiring Government workers) and in debt up to their eyeballs etc.. etc..

The same seems to have happened here too, a country that got too used to the good times that John Howard helped create that they do not remember/do not know/do not care what the bad times are like. And yet just 3 years later and all he money is gone, the Unions are in charge, the debt is mounting and Labor still do not stop spending. It is crazy! and it is even more crazy that 52% of the population don't appear to give a shit either. Utter Madness.

Morning to you!

Yeah, that is exactly what I said, leave the crippled on the hillside.

To be honest though, it is much better than the alternative lefty approach of making the entire population stay on the hillside just because 0.0001% are too crippled to walk down it. If a tiny minority are unable then it is only fair that nobody should be able.

That is exactly what some are suggesting here.

Fixed your post for you.

Every single thing in life is abused by a tiny minority who either are incapable of taking responsibility for their own actions or who simply do not care.

It should not be, and never was supposed to be the Governments job to look after our welfare or run our lives. And just because a minority cannot look after themselves why should the rest of us suffer because of it? This is tragic left wing thinking of the highest order.

If people want to throw all their money away on pokies then it is their own problem, there are many, many more people who like to have a little play and do not hurt anyone. You really believe that the addiction of a tiny minority should overrule the normal, quiet, overwhelming majority?

Personally I hate pokies and wish they never existed, I hate walking by the sad idiots glued to their machines when I go for a piss. BUT I would never dream of imagining it is any of my business to tell anyone how they should spend their own money and live their own lives.

that hurts.

Nice bet.

Bollocks.

cheers, beat my Q5.

Sorry, yes turn not river, I meant this hand..

Full Tilt Poker Game #23125827505: JHDS Satellite Series (177300078), Table 1 - 250/500 Ante 50 - No Limit Hold'em - 07:43:54 ET - 2010/08/16
Seat 4: Smackn_OuT (15,305)
Seat 6: MUR98 (17,695)
Smackn_OuT antes 50
MUR98 antes 50
Smackn_OuT posts the small blind of 250
MUR98 posts the big blind of 500
The button is in seat #4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to MUR98 [As Qd]
Smackn_OuT raises to 1,000
MUR98 raises to 2,500
Smackn_OuT calls 1,500
*** FLOP *** [6c 2c 4c]
MUR98 bets 2,500
Smackn_OuT calls 2,500
*** TURN *** [6c 2c 4c] [4s]
MUR98 checks
Smackn_OuT has 15 seconds left to act
Smackn_OuT bets 5,500
MUR98 folds
Uncalled bet of 5,500 returned to Smackn_OuT
Smackn_OuT mucks
Smackn_OuT wins the pot (10,100)

Rub it in!!

Well played Tony.

Would love you to post the hand when I folded the river after putting a big chunk of my chips in.

Dey Took R Jobs!!